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Thread: My Argento 360

  1. #311
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    Nice one mike.

    While I was happy to lift the spanners for purely mechanical work. Your write up and investigation on the F1 box is another level.

    Bravo

  2. #312
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    ronrob is offline Rear lights like a farm gate - The Ferrari 348 Club Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by achaddy View Post
    Nice one mike.

    While I was happy to lift the spanners for purely mechanical work. Your write up and investigation on the F1 box is another level.

    Bravo
    Second that. I think that the "M" in his name (Mike M) should stand for Monumental. The My Argento 360 thread has been the place to go to for following his systematic, intelligent investigation. Way beyond me.

  3. #313
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    A348W is offline I don't use deodorant Club Member
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    Nice one Mike

    That ďfeatureĒ is interesting. Perhaps itís the software confirming its still where it thinks it is? (I know there is a technical term for this but I only got 19% on my system exam in uni and that was more years ago than I care to count!!)

    Time to put some miles on it before the salt trucks come out

  4. #314
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    Mike01606 is offline Kid's bed - The Ferrari F50 Club Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by achaddy View Post
    Nice one mike.

    While I was happy to lift the spanners for purely mechanical work. Your write up and investigation on the F1 box is another level.

    Bravo
    Quote Originally Posted by ronrob View Post
    Second that. I think that the "M" in his name (Mike M) should stand for Monumental. The My Argento 360 thread has been the place to go to for following his systematic, intelligent investigation. Way beyond me.
    Quote Originally Posted by A348W View Post
    Nice one Mike

    That “feature” is interesting. Perhaps it’s the software confirming its still where it thinks it is? (I know there is a technical term for this but I only got 19% on my system exam in uni and that was more years ago than I care to count!!)

    Time to put some miles on it before the salt trucks come out
    Thanks for the kind comments

    I've had some very good advice along the way which has often stopped me doing some stupid things . Voicey responded on one of my threads saying that only a clutch bleed was needed after the clutch SV change. I could have got there, but I could have also wasted a load of time unnecessarily bleeding the gearbox actuator. A two minute comment from an expert saved me a day and probably more issues and for that I'm extremely thankful.
    Mark S with his 'better than 16M' build sets the ultimate high bar and I've realised one of the pics of the spare SV was his.... I just grabbed it off google images so apols Mark.

    Scott has a really good approach to fixing his cars..... the phrase 'it's only a car' sums it up perfectly. That's what I try to remember and as long as you know your limits.

    What we need a good source of info but alas it will never come as the cars are too low volume with too few DIYers. The WSM is useful for wiring etc (even though there are issues with some of the wiring diagrams) but for the F1 system, apart from the basic control strategy and system overview, it doesn't give you much. It would be interesting to understand how much the techs were actually taught at the factory in the day.
    What I have is a zero hour labour rate so if it doesn't work, I can try again, I enjoy it and I can usually clean it all up whilst I'm in there (there was no real after pics yesterday). For a professional that isn't an option. Yesterday I boxed the car back up again without testing it which could have seen me strip it all apart again. Not because I was confident but because the NHS night staff wouldn't let me start it up!

    For anyone reading this who is unsure about an F1 due to unreliability it is a fairly simple system with the magic happening in the black boxes. They are repairable unlike DSG and when running well, drive sublimely. Getting out last night was fantastic and any of the regular thoughts I have of letting it go disappear when your using the revs and downchange blips..
    Last edited by Mike01606; 22-09-2019 at 10:40 PM.

  5. #315
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike01606 View Post
    Thanks for the kind comments

    I've had some very good advice along the way which has often stopped me doing some stupid things . Voicey responded on one of my threads saying that only a clutch bleed was needed after the clutch SV change. I could have got there, but I could have also wasted a load of time unnecessarily bleeding the gearbox actuator. A two minute comment from an expert saved me a day and probably more issues and for that I'm extremely thankful.
    Mark S with his 'better than 16M' build sets the ultimate high bar and I've realised one of the pics of the spare SV was his.... I just grabbed it off google images so apols Mark.

    Scott has a really good approach to fixing his cars..... the phrase 'it's only a car' sums it up perfectly. That's what I try to remember and as long as you know your limits.

    What we need a good source of info but alas it will never come as the cars are too low volume with too few DIYers. The WSM is useful for wiring etc (even though there are issues with some of the wiring diagrams) but for the F1 system, apart from the basic control strategy and system overview, it doesn't give you much. It would be interesting to understand how much the techs were actually taught at the factory in the day.
    What I have is a zero hour labour rate so if it doesn't work, I can try again, I enjoy it and I can usually clean it all up whilst I'm in there (there was no real after pics yesterday). For a professional that isn't an option. Yesterday I boxed the car back up again without testing it which could have seen me strip it all apart again. Not because I was confident but because the NHS night staff wouldn't let me start it up!

    For anyone reading this who is unsure about an F1 due to unreliability it is a fairly simple system with the magic happening in the black boxes. They are repairable unlike DSG and when running well, drive sublimely. Getting out last night was fantastic and any of the regular thoughts I have of letting it go disappear when your using the revs and downchange blips..
    Great series of posts and a man after my own heart when it comes to de-mystifying exotica.
    They are only cars in the final analysis and from this era onwards reasonably well engineered given their low volumes. Indeed I am writing this surrounded by a brace of McLaren Senna's in a state of deep un-dress and let me tell you there are things under the skin that would make your eyes widen.

    Bottom line is apart from some model specific issues which really should have been ironed out in testing these cars are perfectly usable and reliable for long periods of time providing they are used regularly which seems to be the main problem cause for many issues.

    We could and should have on resources like this a definitive list of tips and their inherent design weaknesses followed by typical failures in use of key components.

    This thread is very useful in that regard.

    Bravo

  6. #316
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike01606 View Post
    Thanks for the kind comments

    I've had some very good advice along the way which has often stopped me doing some stupid things . Voicey responded on one of my threads saying that only a clutch bleed was needed after the clutch SV change. I could have got there, but I could have also wasted a load of time unnecessarily bleeding the gearbox actuator. A two minute comment from an expert saved me a day and probably more issues and for that I'm extremely thankful.
    Mark S with his 'better than 16M' build sets the ultimate high bar and I've realised one of the pics of the spare SV was his.... I just grabbed it off google images so apols Mark.

    Scott has a really good approach to fixing his cars..... the phrase 'it's only a car' sums it up perfectly. That's what I try to remember and as long as you know your limits.

    What we need a good source of info but alas it will never come as the cars are too low volume with too few DIYers. The WSM is useful for wiring etc (even though there are issues with some of the wiring diagrams) but for the F1 system, apart from the basic control strategy and system overview, it doesn't give you much. It would be interesting to understand how much the techs were actually taught at the factory in the day.
    What I have is a zero hour labour rate so if it doesn't work, I can try again, I enjoy it and I can usually clean it all up whilst I'm in there (there was no real after pics yesterday). For a professional that isn't an option. Yesterday I boxed the car back up again without testing it which could have seen me strip it all apart again. Not because I was confident but because the NHS night staff wouldn't let me start it up!

    For anyone reading this who is unsure about an F1 due to unreliability it is a fairly simple system with the magic happening in the black boxes. They are repairable unlike DSG and when running well, drive sublimely. Getting out last night was fantastic and any of the regular thoughts I have of letting it go disappear when your using the revs and downchange blips..
    Nicely put, Mike. Especially about them just being cars, you 'charging' yourself a zero per hour labour rate and being able to spend far more time than a garage could to clean bits up etc. I do a lot of the simpler stuff on my car, that's half the fun of owning one imo.

    When you talk about too few DIYers with the 360 you may find that changing as the cars get a little older. We're spoiled in 348 world, there's masses of info out there - if I wanted to do a complete engine out I could pull up a vid showing me exactly which nut to undo when and how. That sort of thing might soon become available for the slightly newer cars as more and more people realise how much you can do yourself.

    Anyway, enjoy this thread a lot. Look forward to seeing what you get up to next

  7. #317
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    Good work, Mike. Great result.

  8. #318
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    Quote Originally Posted by A348W View Post
    Nice one Mike

    That ďfeatureĒ is interesting. Perhaps itís the software confirming its still where it thinks it is? (I know there is a technical term for this but I only got 19% on my system exam in uni and that was more years ago than I care to count!!)

    Time to put some miles on it before the salt trucks come out
    Put some more miles on it today and it wasnít quite right
    It was great when I went out and warming up but flared slightly (revs rise before clutch engages) in 5th and 6th when hot. Not as positive in the other gears either.
    Put the PIS back to 4.6 which improved it and had a read of the manual.
    Referencing the unknown clutch action and Adrianís comment above there is a set-up procedure called I/O setting. To me I/O means input/output so I followed the procedure which is engine running in N for 5 mins, then 5 mins in 1st with the foot brake on...then engine off.
    Iíve no idea if this was needed or did anything but think the clutch action maybe part of it. A sort of I/O calibration procedure....
    The manual says run the car in N for two minutes if a component is replaced which I must have done already.

    Car drove fine afterwards but Iím not convinced itís as good as it has been.
    I suspect there maybe air in either the clutch circuit or the gearbox actuator.
    I only ran a single clutch bleed procedure when changing the SV, bleeding both points simultaneously and maybe it needs at least two.
    Or by removing the clutch SV air has got into the gearbox selection/ engagement circuits which is an bumper and actuator off job to bleed.

    Mileage is now 48185 in case a future owner is reading this

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