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Ceramic paint protection

sweeni

sweeni

Active member
My 308 is nearing the end of its bodywork restoration and I have been advised to have the car ceramic coated. I know little about ceramic coating other than the promises of an ultra hard shiny finish which will last up to 5 years.
And it’s costs a lot.....

A few questions then:
Are the promises correct or exaggerated
Are there different qualities
What is a reasonable price to have it done
Does it mean no more waxing
Have any of you had it done and if so what do you think

Cheers
 
sweeni said:
My 308 is nearing the end of its bodywork restoration and I have been advised to have the car ceramic coated. I know little about ceramic coating other than the promises of an ultra hard shiny finish which will last up to 5 years.
And it’s costs a lot.....

A few questions then:
Are the promises correct or exaggerated
Are there different qualities
What is a reasonable price to have it done
Does it mean no more waxing
Have any of you had it done and if so what do you think

Cheers
Click to expand...

Hi David

I've had it done and it certainly adds a layer of protection, I think 5 years is a myth and my experience is it's needs re doing annually however (don't read this DaveZ!!) I don't use the 2 bucket mode anymore and get different results, my 458 seems to have super hard paint and never scratches, my FF the paint is like cheese and you only have to look at it to get swirl marks this is irrespective of the ceramic coat.



You can wax over the top and it will potentially give it an even greater shine
 
Have spent a while orbiting planet detailing and most of these crystal, nano, ceramide, aquaphobic,pseudo, molecular-whatever’s have never lived up to the hype.

Had three done of three generations and the all started to look like melted cling film well before the supposed life span. Each was done by trained, serious retailers etc. The products of the detailing world seem to be more hyped than cosmetics. Same with wraps which are very hit and miss depending on the patterns and the shops that do them. A Mate just had his Veyron done by [insert famous social media hyped detailers] and to my engineers eye it just looks **** to be honest. The best any of my cars has ever looked was after a week long detail and the crazy price top of the range Zymol wax. These days I don’t bother other than to wash correctly and then re-spray Stone chipped areas after every couple of years...

Drive it then if it gets so bad you can’t look at it get the paint done again is my stance now.
 
Had mine ceramic coated 2 years ago after having it paint corrected. Certainly still looks great after a simple wash and no need to wax. I was told probably needs redoing after 2-3 years. Was money well spent as far as I'm concerned and will do it again.
 
Hopefully I can bring some industry experience and an honest appraisal for you.
To be clear from the start, my company Morethanpolish Ltd is the UK Distributor for a Belgian Ceramic coating, Kenolon Ceramic Shield, and my other company Race Glaze Ltd markets its own 9H Ceramic product.

Are the promises correct or exaggerated - depends who you listen to ! Its definitely the hottest new thing and there are people peddling dubious products at huge prices. The key is preparation. Any defects under the coating will be magnified, not hidden like wax will.
Are there different qualities - yes. Hardness is one measure - 5, 7 or 9H, but quality and credibility of supplier more so. And quality of application company. This dries like glass and has to be wet sanded off if applied badly - and some are. We run a national training and accreditation scheme for Kenolon so all our guys will do a perfect job. RG 9H is optimised for DIY application by intelligent people (or who can at least read and follow instructions).

What is a reasonable price to have it done - expect £300-400, plus the prep - at least a single stage machine polish.
Does it mean no more waxing - yes. You can wax if you wish but no real point.
Have any of you had it done and if so what do you think - had a panel done on my old P-car as none of my other cars paint is good enough (see above). But I have witnessed and helped apply on about a dozens training courses as well as being trained myself. The Ferrari Centre have a test F430 bumper, which they invite customers to hit with a marker pen. The uncoated side marks, the coated side not.

Durability - we'd expect 30-50,000m, so for cars like Ferraris, much longer.
Shine, beading - outrageous !

Hope that helps.
The Kenolon network is shown here if of interest: http://morethanpolish.com/kenotek-car-care.asp
RG 9H here: http://morethanpolish.com/Race-Glaze-9H-Ceramic.asp
 
MoreThanPolish said:
Hopefully I can bring some industry experience and an honest appraisal for you.
To be clear from the start, my company Morethanpolish Ltd is the UK Distributor for a Belgian Ceramic coating, Kenolon Ceramic Shield, and my other company Race Glaze Ltd markets its own 9H Ceramic product.

Are the promises correct or exaggerated - depends who you listen to ! Its definitely the hottest new thing and there are people peddling dubious products at huge prices. The key is preparation. Any defects under the coating will be magnified, not hidden like wax will.
Are there different qualities - yes. Hardness is one measure - 5, 7 or 9H, but quality and credibility of supplier more so. And quality of application company. This dries like glass and has to be wet sanded off if applied badly - and some are. We run a national training and accreditation scheme for Kenolon so all our guys will do a perfect job. RG 9H is optimised for DIY application by intelligent people (or who can at least read and follow instructions).

What is a reasonable price to have it done - expect £300-400, plus the prep - at least a single stage machine polish.
Does it mean no more waxing - yes. You can wax if you wish but no real point.
Have any of you had it done and if so what do you think - had a panel done on my old P-car as none of my other cars paint is good enough (see above). But I have witnessed and helped apply on about a dozens training courses as well as being trained myself. The Ferrari Centre have a test F430 bumper, which they invite customers to hit with a marker pen. The uncoated side marks, the coated side not.

Durability - we'd expect 30-50,000m, so for cars like Ferraris, much longer.
Shine, beading - outrageous !

Hope that helps.
The Kenolon network is shown here if of interest: http://morethanpolish.com/kenotek-car-care.asp
RG 9H here: http://morethanpolish.com/Race-Glaze-9H-Ceramic.asp
Click to expand...

Many thanks for that, given me a much better insight.
Given that the car is having a full bare metal respray I can't imagine that much prep would be required or am I being naive?
The company doing the bodywork also do ceramic coating but they say it will be "around £1200 - £1500 but we will do a proper quote", you say a far more realistic £300 - £400, and how can I be sure who can it it correctly? (Looking at your link I see that there is only one dealer in Yorkshire)
Can it also be applied to wheels?
 
I have not had the F355 coated - it needs a bit of minor work on the paint - but I did a fair bit of research on this for my daily driver (Mustang GT). Within a few days of taking delivery it went to have a full Gtechniq Crystal Serum with EXO coating and the wheels were given the Armour coating. Considering the car was built some three months previously in the good old USofA I asked for the detailer to provide any paint correction etc. as well. Amazingly the paint was in fine fettle with just a light polish required and a bit of light roughness removed from the offside front wing (or is that fender?). - a testament to ‘humble’ Ford’s paint process.

The immediate results were amazing. The car looked as if it had been waxed to the highest standard and the water beading quite astonishing. Now, some 17 months later, the finish is still top notch. The car always looks clean even when, on close inspection, it is actually not so and remained looking clean throughout the winter. Dirt does not stick to it and a quick spray over with the pressure washer (just water, no shampoo or wash mit involved) brings it up looking much better than it has any right to. Washing it properly is a doddle and after a good wash the water beading is still amazing. The wheels are something else - never in my (very) long driving history have wheels been so easy to clean - no special lotions or potions required just straight forward car shampoo with no scrubbing necessary.

The finish is guaranteed for seven years. Will it remain so, only time will tell and I’ll probably have replaced the car within that time anyway. Would I do it again? Definitely yes. Was it expensive? Yes, just under a £grand.

Do I recommend it? Yes.
 
I can offer you a perspective from the DIY end of the market.

I applied Carpro CQuartz v3.0 UK Edition to two cars earlier this year (about 3 months ago), and have been very impressed with the results. They are significantly easier to clean, and after a wash they gleam like they've just been waxed. That particular product has a supposed 2 year lifespan, although I don't really know how long it lasts yet. There are plenty of vids on youtube of people who've had it on for a year with continued good results.

CQuartz (and other similar ones) has a top up spray that can be applied every 3 months or so to help keep the coating in good shape. I haven't bought that yet, but it applies like a quick detail spray so is easy to do. Although it's a ceramic coating, it can be removed with a ceramic based polish so if you cock it up it's easy to fix. Cock ups should be extremely unlikely though because it is so easy to apply. You just need to remove the residue very thoroughly otherwise smudges will remain and can't be removed without polishing again if left for too long. Workable time is several minutes so there's plenty of time to remove residue for say a 2ft square section.

If you like waxing you won't like any ceramic coating, even the DIY ones. They're just too low maintenance! The CarPro stuff looks like you've just waxed it immediately after washing. So there's absolutely no point in applying wax anyway. It can be layered as well but I'm only on one coat at present.

Before applying I did a single stage polish with a rotary and a Menzerna final finish product (Can't remember the product code off the top of my head but it's the super fine finishing one I used). Total effort on each car was about 10 hours.

Based on my experience with the DIY stuff, I'm sure the professional stuff is very good. There is just one thing - I wouldn't pay 300-400 quid for a pro application. I'd rather pay the £60 or so it cost me to do the two cars and do it once every 18 months or so.

One really impressive thing about it is that after washing and rinsing I can easily blow 90% of the water off with a hand held workshop blower (mine's a Ryobi one+ device) and subsequent drying with a microfiber takes virtually no time at all.

I've always preferred wax but I was an instant convert after applying and even more so after the first wash.
 
I had my car detailed by a company local to me, Autocurators, in Jan 2017 and then coated using their own branded Ceramic glaze. No idea what it actually is or where it came from. I was very impressed with the finish and the ease of washing it.

Earlier in 2018 I had some small repainting done and got them to "top up" the affected areas. Over that time I have washed my car with a snow foam, and a jet wash. Occasionally need to remove some stubborn stuff with a mitt, but generally speaking it just comes up clean and using one of Mark Wibberleys water softener filters for the final rinse I only have to do a cursory final dry with a microfibre towel to have the car looking pristine. As others have said, the beading is amazing.

I drove my car to Maranello in June and it got there pretty dirty. I found a local jet wash and 10 minutes use of that with no detergent and the car was immaculate.

I now have a tub of very expensive Swissvax wax sitting going to waste.
 
MoreThanPolish said:
Hopefully I can bring some industry experience and an honest appraisal for you.
To be clear from the start, my company Morethanpolish Ltd is the UK Distributor for a Belgian Ceramic coating, Kenolon Ceramic Shield, and my other company Race Glaze Ltd markets its own 9H Ceramic product.

Are the promises correct or exaggerated - depends who you listen to ! Its definitely the hottest new thing and there are people peddling dubious products at huge prices. The key is preparation. Any defects under the coating will be magnified, not hidden like wax will.
Are there different qualities - yes. Hardness is one measure - 5, 7 or 9H, but quality and credibility of supplier more so. And quality of application company. This dries like glass and has to be wet sanded off if applied badly - and some are. We run a national training and accreditation scheme for Kenolon so all our guys will do a perfect job. RG 9H is optimised for DIY application by intelligent people (or who can at least read and follow instructions).

What is a reasonable price to have it done - expect £300-400, plus the prep - at least a single stage machine polish.
Does it mean no more waxing - yes. You can wax if you wish but no real point.
Have any of you had it done and if so what do you think - had a panel done on my old P-car as none of my other cars paint is good enough (see above). But I have witnessed and helped apply on about a dozens training courses as well as being trained myself. The Ferrari Centre have a test F430 bumper, which they invite customers to hit with a marker pen. The uncoated side marks, the coated side not.

Durability - we'd expect 30-50,000m, so for cars like Ferraris, much longer.
Shine, beading - outrageous !

Hope that helps.
The Kenolon network is shown here if of interest: http://morethanpolish.com/kenotek-car-care.asp
RG 9H here: http://morethanpolish.com/Race-Glaze-9H-Ceramic.asp
Click to expand...

Just had the Kenlon product supplied by Mark applied to my 430 by Kent High Performance Cars, had the front end (bumper, wings, bonnet, sills and mirrors) repainted, the whole lot paint corrected, Kenlon applied and then the front end wrapped in some sort of self healing film. To say it looks stunning is an understatement. Sorry, don't have any pictures yet, I'm still waiting for my garage to be finished so the car is still up in storage with Roger. My own opinion would be that it's a worthwhile process - this based on having seen the results of what would be a professional application.
 
sweeni - on new fresh paint the coating can, after sufficient time has elapsed for paint curing, be applied without any real prep (a pre-coat is part of the ceramic system). £12-1500 is taking the mick..

Our guy is Yorkshire will come to your house and is very methodical, mature and experienced.

The problem with this market is its full of smoke and mirrors, fancy prices and techno-babble aka bull***t. As long as the product is of certifiable quality, applied by someone who knows what they are doing (pro or DIY) you will have an awesome finish that stays that way.

I would ceramic coat all my cars if they were good enough.
 
MoreThanPolish said:
sweeni - on new fresh paint the coating can, after sufficient time has elapsed for paint curing, be applied without any real prep (a pre-coat is part of the ceramic system). £12-1500 is taking the mick..

Our guy is Yorkshire will come to your house and is very methodical, mature and experienced.

The problem with this market is its full of smoke and mirrors, fancy prices and techno-babble aka bull***t. As long as the product is of certifiable quality, applied by someone who knows what they are doing (pro or DIY) you will have an awesome finish that stays that way.
Click to expand...

How long approx does new paint need to cure? Thats just what I thought of his off the cuff price.
If it can be done at home this would be excellent.
Just what I thought, hence my thread asking lots of questions. I will be having it done as Im convinced its the right thing to do after having spent a small fortune on the respray.
 
David

You won't regret going the ceramic route. I can't comment on how long new paint takes to cure, but today I washed my car. It was filthy. As you may know I had it trailered back from Le Mans after some nasty transmission noises. That is now all fixed. But the car was untouched since my trip and was covered in flies, road dirt, oily bits from being worked on and general crap from being in a workshop for 6 weeks.

An initial blast with a jetspray removed most of the crap and the beading already looked great. Then a 15 minute soak with snowfoam and another rinse left just a couple of small bits to clean with my favourite ph neutral shampoo. Then a final rinse with purified water, 10 minutes with some drying towels and bingo - car looks just like it did when the ceramic coat was first applied 18 months ago. All dead easy. Waxing would have been another couple of hours work at least.
 
francisn said:
Waxing would have been another couple of hours work at least.
Click to expand...

Must confess I don’t mind waxing my car at all, in fact I find it quite enjoyable. I’ve seen a few cars with ceramic coat applied and although they are shiny, I’ve never seen the depth of shine you get with a premium carnauba wax. Sort of guessing it doesn’t smell as good as Swisswax Scuderia either.

All in all I think ceramic coats have their place, particularly if you’re lazy Francis :wink3: but I don’t think it’s better than wax. It’s easier, just not better.

Happy for a ‘shine off’ wax vs ceramic if anyone’s up for it :grin:
 
Nosevi said:
Must confess I don’t mind waxing my car at all, in fact I find it quite enjoyable. I’ve seen a few cars with ceramic coat applied and although they are shiny, I’ve never seen the depth of shine you get with a premium carnauba wax. Sort of guessing it doesn’t smell as good as Swisswax Scuderia either.

All in all I think ceramic coats have their place, particularly if you’re lazy Francis :wink3: but I don’t think it’s better than wax. It’s easier, just not better.

Happy for a ‘shine off’ wax vs ceramic if anyone’s up for it :grin:
Click to expand...

Ha - Pete

You obviously don't drive your car enough and regularly get it dirty ;-)

F :tongue3:
 
ric355 said:
I can offer you a perspective from the DIY end of the market.

I applied Carpro CQuartz v3.0 UK Edition to two cars earlier this year (about 3 months ago), and have been very impressed with the results. They are significantly easier to clean, and after a wash they gleam like they've just been waxed. That particular product has a supposed 2 year lifespan, although I don't really know how long it lasts yet. There are plenty of vids on youtube of people who've had it on for a year with continued good results.

CQuartz (and other similar ones) has a top up spray that can be applied every 3 months or so to help keep the coating in good shape. I haven't bought that yet, but it applies like a quick detail spray so is easy to do. Although it's a ceramic coating, it can be removed with a ceramic based polish so if you cock it up it's easy to fix. Cock ups should be extremely unlikely though because it is so easy to apply. You just need to remove the residue very thoroughly otherwise smudges will remain and can't be removed without polishing again if left for too long. Workable time is several minutes so there's plenty of time to remove residue for say a 2ft square section.

If you like waxing you won't like any ceramic coating, even the DIY ones. They're just too low maintenance! The CarPro stuff looks like you've just waxed it immediately after washing. So there's absolutely no point in applying wax anyway. It can be layered as well but I'm only on one coat at present.

Before applying I did a single stage polish with a rotary and a Menzerna final finish product (Can't remember the product code off the top of my head but it's the super fine finishing one I used). Total effort on each car was about 10 hours.

Based on my experience with the DIY stuff, I'm sure the professional stuff is very good. There is just one thing - I wouldn't pay 300-400 quid for a pro application. I'd rather pay the £60 or so it cost me to do the two cars and do it once every 18 months or so.

One really impressive thing about it is that after washing and rinsing I can easily blow 90% of the water off with a hand held workshop blower (mine's a Ryobi one+ device) and subsequent drying with a microfiber takes virtually no time at all.

I've always preferred wax but I was an instant convert after applying and even more so after the first wash.
Click to expand...

Sounds good. I've been looking at this for a while. Had the 360 paint corrected a couple of months back and I'm scared when I wash it now, even bought two buckets and grit guards :laugh: :tongue3:. Combined with a first for me in many, many years I'm getting a brand new car in October and they've offered paint protection but I'm not sure what it actually is. Anyway I think I'm going to do this myself on both the 360 and new car.

Is this it? https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/CarPro-C...846886&hash=item3b11f8049e:g:4iQAAOSw2idbNhsw
 
Last edited:
Francis - no need to clay as I doubt there's anything stuck to the paint

MalcH - reading the description, its written in poor English so I'd wonder if the product is genuine ? If its UK product I'd expect flawless grammar.

An alternative product is ours, not available on popular auction sites though, and optimised for home application. Ideal for a new car or resprayed car application. I'd give it 4-6 weeks before doing a newly painted car.

See: http://www.raceglaze.co.uk/car-care-exterior/ceramic-car-paint-body-9H-glass-coating-uk/
 
Ceramic coating v wax : One clear advantage of the ceramic coating is that it is extremely hard which makes it highly resistant to swirls and scratching etc. The coating I had applied is not available for general sale and is only available via their franchised and trained detailers. Two reasons were given for this a) a wet edge has to be maintained during application so reasonably quick work is required otherwise the edge is noticeable; and b) if a problem occurs during application then the coating cannot be easily removed/corrected by the DIY user - it literally has to be sanded off!

This does have the downside that if a panel needs some repainting in the future then the preparation required is significantly more than usual!
 
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